The full text to the blog post at the White Horse Inn is below.

I was intrigued by a recent conversation between Doug Wilson and Mark Driscoll (interview video above).

I’d prefer to keep my thoughts to myself, but I think there’s a crucial piece missing from the “debate.”

As I said in an earlier post ( Reformed and Charismatic?), I’m not willing to die on the hill of cessationism. In fact, I’d fit into the category that Doug Wilson describes as “a cessaionist who believes strange things happen.” A sovereign God is free to fulfill his purposes as he pleases. As God, the Holy Spirit is not on a leash.

However, this misses the point. No Calvinist would believe that the Spirit is not free or that he cannot speak directly to people today as he did in the days of the prophets and apostles. Nor are Reformed Christians deists for believing that, as a rule, he doesn’t. In fact, the church was not guided by anti-supernaturalism when it rejected the claims of the Montanists in the late second century. Nor were Luther and Calvin under the spell of the Enlightenment when they challenged the “enthusiasts” for pitting the Word against the Spirit.

The Spirit is not bound by anything, but he freely binds himself to his Word. The question is not where the Spirit may work, but where he has promised to work. If strange things happen—similar to events in the era of the prophets and apostles, praise the Lord! However, one doesn’t have a right to expect the Spirit to work except where he has promised to work and through the means that the Triune God has ordained.

Like older charismatic-cessationist debates in evangelicalism, this newer discussion therefore has the wrong categories. The real issue isn’t whether the sign-gifts have ceased; it’s whether the Spirit works through ordinary means that Christ ordained explicitly or whether he works through extraordinary means that were identified with the extraordinary ministry of the apostles. Even deeper than that, it’s a question of whether we embrace a paradigm in which the Spirit’s work is identified with direct and immediate activity within us apart from ordinary means or through the external Word and sacraments. The history of “enthusiasm” (Protestant or otherwise) trends toward an almost Gnostic dualism between spirit and matter, indirect and inner experience versus mediated and external ministry, the individual heart and the covenant community. This is where the seismic fault is revealed. It’s at this point where the real differences—paradigmatic differences—become evident. And there are plenty of cessationists as well as charismatics who presuppose the “enthusiastic” paradigm.

In this interview, my friend Mark Driscoll expresses his worry that cessationists believe in the “Father, Son, and Holy Bible.” That may well be. In fact, one of the things that I’ve emphasized especially in recent years is the richness of the Spirit’s person and work that is actually far more evident in classic Reformed as well as patristic faith and practice than today. The temptation to celebrate the Spirit over the Word in our day is in part a reaction against a conservative tendency to separate the Word from the Spirit. He has also said elsewhere that where Reformed people attribute God’s work to the gospel, charismatics attribute it to the Spirit. We talk past each other, he says. I’m not so sure. Rather, I think we’re operating with quite different paradigms. When we attribute God’s work to the gospel, it’s actually attributing it to the Spirit who works through the gospel.

The choice between Spirit and Word is a false one that has typically been forced by Protestant enthusiasm. We do speak past each other, but because we have different paradigms—not just because of different views of whether the sign-gifts have ceased. For example, the Heidelberg Catechism asks, “Where does this true faith come from?” Answer: “The Holy Spirit creates it in our hearts by the preaching of the holy gospel and confirms it by the holy sacraments.” Who creates it? The Holy Spirit. How? Through preaching the gospel and by ratifying it through the baptism and the Supper.

When Reformed people (and others) speak of preaching, baptism, Communion, covenantal nurture in the home, church discipline, diaconal ministry and so forth, our charismatic brothers and sisters wonder, “Where is the Holy Spirit?” Why? Because they have come to see the Spirit’s work as separate from—even antithetical to—the external ministry of the church and ordinary means of grace.

Of course, this point doesn’t address the issues, much less pretend to solve them. However, my hope at least is that we could have a better conversation than the usual debate question: “The Sign-Gifts Have Ceased: Pro or Con?”

Before I get into how people change I want to say a few things about Wednesday night.  We have had and will continue to have some great things happening on Wednesday night.  The Wednesday night meal continues on, with the energy of new leadership provided by Amy Houston.  We are adding a time of corporate worship immediate following the meal to set our minds on the Lord and enrich our fellowship.  (Just a few minutes of singing together with God’s people can do wonders for your spiritual life in the middle of the week!) 

This year we are launching our Wednesday Night Ministry with a Block Party (Wed. September 7^th, 5:30-8:00PM.)  We will enjoy being together and having a place to welcome our friends and neighbors.  The Elevation Band (i.e., the folks who play in worship) has been hard at work to prepare live music.  In addition to the songs that we sing in corporate worship, the band has prepared some other pieces just for this event. Benjamin Harding tells me quality is superb, so bring your friends out for some serious live music.  We will have tables at the Block Party that present the ministries that will take place on Wednesday night.  We will have food on hand for purchase, but you are welcome to bring your own food as well. (We have asked these vendors to make and sell food.  We are not sharing in their profits, nor have we made guarantees to them.)      

On Wednesday evenings this fall I will be leading a study using the book entitled How People Change, by Tim Lane and Paul Tripp.  Paul Tripp is a second generation pioneer of the biblical counseling movement begun by Jay Adams, and appreciated by so many in our church through the Self-Confrontation courses led by the Evers, Zitlaus and Hilberts over the years.  Tim Lane is a professor of biblical counseling at the Christian Counseling and Educational Foundation affiliated with Westminster Seminary.  How People Change is a comprehensive presentation of a gospel centered approach to change.  It is the type of book that is worthy of re-reading, re-studying time and again.  I chose this book because it is rich in application, replete with examples and deep (yet accessible) in theology. 

Rich in Application—How People Change provides an opportunity for extended reflection on topics relevant to us all. We will have ample time—more time than in Sunday school and, in some cases, than in small groups—to have give and take discussion on living the Christian life.  We will be able to grow together.  Folks new to our fellowship will be able to grow with us if they are Christians, or be exposed first hand to the way that we as believers approach the challenges of our lives. 

Replete with Examples—Tripp and Lane have culled many real life examples from their counseling experience. These examples provide points of contact for discussion and application.  I have found the examples to be encouraging and challenging.  One cannot help but see oneself on occasion in the pages of this book.  It is both a comfort and a challenge to see a fellow gospel traveler struggling to live out the good news. 

Deep, Yet Accessible in Theology—Lane and Tripp are well studied in the biblical-theological tradition, especially in its Dutch-Calvinist expression (Vos and Ridderbos).  Each chapter begins with a brief, yet sufficient overview of a facet of the New Testament’s teaching on God’s work in Christ for us past, present and future.  By framing the discussion this way the authors not only help us to think more clearly about our own relationship with Christ, they also help us to think more clearly about the Bible itself.  In other words, your daily bible reading, approach to sermons and other studies will be enriched by our study of How People Change. 

This study is open to men and women of all ages, couples and singles alike.  As I have already shared with the WIC leadership, there is no intention to replace or compete with the current evening WIC study.  That ministry is well grounded and much needed.  As pastor of the whole church I am happy to see people find their place of fellowship and growth, wherever that is.  I am hopeful that this study can become a place of such growth and fellowship for those who have the time Wednesday night but have not had the opportunity or found their place—men, women, singles, parents with children in youth ministry and couples desiring to grow together.  Please pray for this new study and all our Wednesday night ministries. 

See you at the Block Party!

Pastor Harvey

This year we are launching our Wednesday Night Ministry with a Block Party (Wed. September 7^th, 5:30-8:00PM.)  We will enjoy being together and having a place to welcome our friends and neighbors.  The Elevation Band (i.e., the folks who play in worship) has been hard at work to prepare live music.  In addition to the songs that we sing in corporate worship, the band has prepared some other pieces just for this event. Benjamin Harding tells me quality is superb, so bring your friends out for some serious live music.  We will have tables at the Block Party that present the ministries that will take place on Wednesday night.  We will have food on hand for purchase, but you are welcome to bring your own food as well. (We have asked these vendors to make and sell food.  We are not sharing in their profits, nor have we made guarantees to them.) 

On Wednesday evenings this fall I will be leading a study using the book entitled How People Change, by Tim Lane and Paul Tripp.  Paul Tripp is a second generation pioneer of the biblical counseling movement begun by Jay Adams, and appreciated by so many in our church through the Self-Confrontation courses led by the Evers, Zitlaus and Hilberts over the years.  Tim Lane is a Professor of Biblical Counseling at the Christian Counseling and Educational Foundation affiliated with Westminster Seminary.  How People Change is a comprehensive presentation of a gospel centered approach to change.  It is the type of book that is worthy of re-reading and re-studying time and again.  I chose this book because it is rich in application, replete with examples and deep (yet accessible) in theology. 

Rich in Application—How People Change provides an opportunity for extended reflection on topics relevant to us all. We will have ample time—more time than in Sunday school and, in some cases, than in small groups—to have give and take discussion on living the Christian life.  We will be able to grow together.  Folks new to our fellowship will be able to grow with us if they are Christians, or be exposed first hand to the way that we as believers approach the challenges of our lives. 

Replete with Examples—Tripp and Lane have culled many real life examples from their counseling experience. These examples provide points of contact for discussion and application.  I have found the examples to be encouraging and challenging.  One cannot help but see oneself on occasion in the pages of this book.  It is both a comfort and a challenge to see a fellow gospel traveler struggling to live out the Good News. 

Deep, Yet Accessible, in Theology—Lane and Tripp are well studied in the biblical-theological tradition, especially in its Dutch-Calvinist expression (Vos and Ridderbos). Each chapter begins with a brief, yet sufficient overview of a facet of the New Testament’s teaching on God’s work in Christ for us past, present and future.  By framing the discussion this way the authors not only help us to think more clearly about our own relationship with Christ, they also help us to think more clearly about the Bible itself.  In other words, your daily bible reading, approach to sermons and other studies will be enriched by our study of How People Change. 

This study is open to men and women of all ages, couples and singles alike.  As I have already shared with the WIC leadership, there is no intention to replace or compete with the current evening WIC study.  That ministry is well grounded and much needed.  As pastor of the whole church I am happy to see people find their place of fellowship and growth, wherever that is.  I am hopeful that this study can become a place of such growth and fellowship for those who have the time on Wednesday night but have not had the opportunity or found their place—men, women, singles, parents with children in youth ministry and couples desiring to grow together.  Please pray for this new study and all our Wednesday night ministries. 

See you at the Block Party!

Pastor Jay 

Larry DeHeer

Sometimes when we walk once again a familiar, cherished, and oft traveled path, we do not become aware of what is new, or was missed on earlier walks. Rather we simply feel wonderfully at home, reveling in the walk. That is the way I experienced the conference, wonderfully at home with the walk through the marvels of the gospel of the resurrection. It is the healing balm for every wound of life, the energy food for continuing work, and the seed of compassion for those to whom the resurrection will not be pure joy, but sheer terror.  I got a fresh prescription.

Alan Beattie

I enjoyed the discussion of one of the more difficult verses in the New Testament,  I Cor 15:29, (i.e., ” being baptized on behalf of the dead . . .”) and the insights shared about the verse.  Also I previously understood I Cor 15:33 (“Do not be deceived: Bad company ruins good morals. . . “) to mean some type of immorality other than simply heretical teaching about the resurrection and found his explanation straightforward and engaging. Finally, the charge handed to the believer in I Cor. 15:58 to “. . . be steadfast, immovable, always abounding in the work of the Lord . . . ” and the discussion of what “abounding in the work of the Lord” means was very practical.

Naomi Hufnell

I can’t say that I learned anymore about the resurrection than I did before but it did make it clearer to me.  The first night I thought his talk was on the plan on salvation…thank you Lord that I am your child.  It also made me realize how I fall so short of being a witness,  It was wonderful to go and to be with with all who are in one accord with the Lord

Kristin Syanene

On Sunday morning Dr. Waters mentioned that when Jesus wept at Lazarus’ tomb, He was moved more out of righteous anger than from grief. I had never thought of Jesus’ reaction in this way but it fits with the imagery of Jesus defeating death, sin, and Satan when He died on the cross and then rose.

Amy Huffman

Although I already believed in the bodily resurrection the conference helped me to more fully appreciate the centrality of the bodily resurrection to my faith in Christ.

Kristen Rose

I was particularly struck by Dr. Waters reminder that death is not natural. I always think of death as a natural part of life. We live and we die. But it is not, it is God’s just penalty for our sin. Because Jesus was willing to face death on our behalf and conquer death for us, we can share in His victory over death. What an encouragement this has been to remember that this life is not all there is. We have the hope of a new body in glory that will be indwelled with the Holy Spirit. It helps to give me an eternal perspective instead getting caught up in the here and now.

Todd Metzler

Was encouraged by the clarity, humility, biblical faithfulness and intelligence of Dr. Waters. The Q&A on Saturday night was especially helpful…It was a true blessing to have him here to preach through I Corinthians 15. Christ is risen on the 3rd day!

Margaret Botbyl

I learned more about the difference between our eathly body and our heavenly body. I was encouraged by participating in this confrence with my fellow christian friends.

Melanie Vinson

I appreciated Dr. Water’s comment that death is not a natural part of life but a result of sin. I know that is true but never heard it put the way he did.